Seeing Them Live

S02E07 - ZouZou Mansour and the Music of Soraia

Episode Summary

In this episode, hosts Charles and Doug engage with ZouZou Mansour, the dynamic lead singer of the Philadelphia-based band Soraia. Soraia has opened for major bands like Joan Jet and Jon Bon Jovi. ZouZou reflects on her earliest concert experiences, including how seeing Hall and Oates and Iggy Pop significantly shaped her musical path. The conversation explores Soraia’s discography, their fan interactions, and their collaboration with major artists like Steven Van Zandt and Jon Bon Jovi. Additionally, listeners get tantalizing details about the band’s upcoming vinyl re-release of 'Shed the Skin,' their social media presence, and upcoming shows.

Episode Notes

In this engaging episode of Seeing Them Live, hosts Charles and Doug welcome ZouZou Mansour. Along with drummer Brianna Sig and bassist Travis Smith (both musical and visual artists in their own right), ZouZou is the dynamic lead singer and lyricist of Philadelphia's rock band Soraia. Among other artists, ZouZou has co-written songs with Steven Van Zandt and Jon Bon Jovi.

Join Charles and Doug as we explore these and other topics with ZouZou:

- What was ZouZou’s first concert?

- What artist influenced ZouZou to change the course of her career?

- What happened when she and her band met Alice Cooper backstage at a Bruce Springsteen concert?

- What is it like to work with Steven Van Zandt?

- What is Soraia’s methodology for naming their albums?

- What influenced the naming of their “Bloom” album?

- Why is ZouZou attracted to the horror genre?

- Why does Soraia like to record cover songs?

- What is the Soraia “Vault”?

- Why does ZouZou love hot dogs?

The discussion charts ZouZou’s musical journey, beginning with her early concert experiences seeing Hall and Oates to a transformative Iggy Pop performance that reshaped her artistic approach. We delve into Soraia's unique blend of 90s influences and 60s garage rock, their evolution over three impactful albums produced under Little Steven Van Zandt's Wicked Cool Records, and the band’s dedicated fan base. ZouZou shares insights into her songwriting process, the raw, uninhibited spirit of rock and roll, and her penchant for horror-themed music videos. Fans can also look forward to Soraia's re-release of 'Shed the Skin' on vinyl and upcoming shows. The light-hearted conversation wraps up with a fun note on ZouZou's love of hot dogs, and where fans can find Soraia's music and merchandise online.

BANDS MENTIONED: Alice Cooper, Bee Gees, Billy Falcon, Brianna Sig, Bruce Springsteen, Clarence Clemons, Concrete Blonde, Daryl Hall, E Street Band, Elvis Presley, Hall and Oates, Iggy Pop, Joan Jett, Jon Bon Jovi, Nirvana, P. J. Harvey, The Pretenders, Prince, Soraia, Steven Van Zandt, Stooges, The Kills, Travis Smith, Tropical Fuckstorm, ZouZou Mansoor.

VENUES MENTIONED: CBGB (New York), Le Poisson Rouge (New York), Liar's Club (Chicago), Spectrum (Philadelphia)

Episode Transcription

[00:00:00] Charles: Our guest today is ZouZou Mansoor. ZouZou is the lead singer of the Philadelphia based band Soraia. Soraia's music has been described as having elements of kindred spirits of the 90s and beyond, like P. J. Harvey and The Kills, with more than a sprinkling of 60s garage rock and soul. Their songs spread a message of perseverance through the trials of love, loss, and letting go. 

[00:00:26] Soraia has been recording music since the early 2000s. Their last three albums have been recorded on Little Steven Van Zandt's record label, Wicked Cool Records. The band will be setting out on an extensive tour starting June 8th and the tour dates are available on the Soraia website. ZouZou, welcome to Seeing Them Live.

[00:00:48] ZouZou: Hi, it's nice to be here.

[00:00:49] Charles: And, uh, we're also joined by my cohost and producer, Doug Florzak. As we do with all of our guests, ZouZou, I want to talk about the Soraia discography and some stories around your fan base and such. But, I thought we could start maybe with what was your, do you remember what was your first concert experience? Your live music experience.

[00:01:14] ZouZou: My first concert experience, I had to be like eight or nine and I went and so I won tickets to go see Hall and Oates at the Spectrum in Philadelphia. It was terrifying. That's all I remember about it because I remember my dad saying to my brother, you watch her, like take care of her. And you know, they were like a radio station tickets.

[00:01:39] And I was like, so far we were, I just remember being like behind the stage or something. Like, I just remember, because I'd never even known what it like, I had no idea what I was getting into. And, um, my brother left as soon as the music started, he went like straight down and I was like, I don't think we're allowed to do that.

[00:01:58] And I was such a kid. Like, so I, I don't remember any of it at all. I just remember seeing the back of Daryl Hall or Hall's, Hall's head. Cause he was singing.

[00:02:08] That's all I remember. And I was scared. Like, that's really the only thing I remember about my first concert, but I do remember really clearly how I felt, which was absolutely like, I don't know what I'm supposed to be feeling and I'm terrified. Which is funny when you're going to hear what was my most influential concert experience. 

[00:02:26] Charles: Yeah, I know for a young, you know, person, being immersed in like all those people and the music. Yeah, that could be totally overwhelming. I would imagine. 

[00:02:36] ZouZou: It really was.

[00:02:38] Charles: Yeah, go on to your, like, if you have like a memorable one or, you know, since you're a musician, we like to ask if there was a, a point or, um, a performance that inspired you to be a musician.

[00:02:51] I know you've, you've said in interviews that you've kind of always known this, that you wanted to be a musician, but, was there one in particular that kind of really hit you, you know, or solidified those feelings? 

[00:03:02] ZouZou: Yeah. I'm just, I was thinking, but I think the one that like hit me the most, actually, I was already singing and I was already in the band that I'm in now, but it changed everything. Um, and I just wrote about it the other day because it was his birthday. It was Iggy Pop. Um, but it was Iggy Pop with the Stooges and, um, at the time I had this view of being in a band that you had to look a certain way, you had to act a certain way.

[00:03:27] And I had people around me, producers, et cetera, that were telling me that too, telling me I had to be something in order to be successful. And it just felt very, forced and very phony. And I'm not that, I'm not able like, you know, there's something, there's a difference between music being a show versus being, um, like, I'm not a musical theater person. Let's put it that way. So like, I love theater. Like I love Alice Cooper, but I don't, I'm not personally, like I have to get up there and like a hundred percent be myself, that's when I feel most at home on stage, which I didn't know before I went in 2013, um, actually my co-band member, my co-writer Travis Smith who's been in my band since like day one. Um, well, not really day one since I started singing but day one as Soraia as it is today. 

[00:04:15] And, um, he's like, listen, I won tickets to go see Iggy Pop and the Stooges in New York, Brooklyn at Le Poisson Rouge. And cause he's like, well, first he said, what are you doing on Sunday? And I was like, well, and before I even like got past, well, he said, he's like, okay, cool, we're going to see Iggy Pop and the Stooges at Le Poisson Rouge. I was like, okay, like, I was like, I don't really know if I even like Iggy Pop. I know Lust for Life and from Trainspotting, but I didn't really know Iggy and the Stooges and I was a little uncomfortable even going and um, he's like, you're going to have the best time.

[00:04:52] And we went and I remember Iggy came like pouncing onto the stage now at this point I think he's in his 60s. I guess is like mid 60s. No, he just turned 77. Yeah, he was in his late 60s. So, and he like just bounced onto the stage and he had like a limp So he's like, I know this isn't visual but he like was limping.

[00:05:11] I'm showing them. He's limping and and I saw What is that thing? Like he literally like, not what is that thing, but like what is, I've never seen anything like that in my life. Like, and he was so exciting and so like, I felt alive and, and you know, Travis, like, he's like, do you care if I go to the front?

[00:05:28] I'm like, uh, and he is shot to the front and I was like, oh, my guy's gonna get killed. And he wasn't. And he was like hitting people on the head and everybody was just happy, you know, like nobody was dressed as certain, everybody was looked different. Like, no, no one looked. Like everybody else. Like there was no, I wouldn't say I looked around and went, Oh, that's an Iggy fan or that's a Stooges fan.

[00:05:48] Like everybody just looked like them. Like there was no, it was very diverse. And so of course I ran up to the front cause I was by myself at that point. And nobody was. Having the kind of fun he was having up there. So I went up front and we both ended up on stage at the end. 

[00:06:02] Charles: Oh my goodness. 

[00:06:03] ZouZou: Oh yeah, it was very freeing. And what I, what I left that concert with, and I, I cut off ties with all those people I was working with at that point. I was like, I'm done with those people. Like I'm done with that idea of that's what rock and roll has to be, you know what I mean? Like, um, it just, it just was like time. And I just felt like if I'm going to do this, forever, which I know I have to because it's in my blood.

[00:06:28] I have to do it on my terms. And the way that, that they were doing it, like I wanted to be, feel like not embarrassed about anything. I didn't care what size I was or what I look like or what kind of mess I was at the end. Like I wanted people to feel what I felt at that show. Because that to me is what rock and roll is.

[00:06:47] Like I always wanted to be part of this community that was just, you know, the people on like kind of the cusp of the show. You know, of the world even and like, just thought differently and felt differently, but connected as a community because we were that and my whole life, I felt like that. So it was only natural that I wanted to be part of that tribe.

[00:07:07] You know what I mean? And, and I think that concert was such a big effect on me and it's not like I left and I hated all the bands I loved growing up. No, I still, I love those bands, but who I brought to the stage was very different from that date in August of 2013 onward from who I was before that. Um, and it eventually caught up with my writing as well. I got more honest in my writing a little more like not trying to cater to anyone in particular, just writing what I felt. And, and I really write from the first person all the time. 

[00:07:41] Charles: Yeah. There, ithere's nothing inauthentic about Iggy live. I've seen him many times and yeah, I remember one time he came out just wearing like a pair of faded jeans and the top button unbuttoned and that was it. And like you're saying, you're looking at him, he doesn't have like a drop of fat on him.

[00:08:02] ZouZou: Yep. 

[00:08:03] Charles: And he's just a maniac, you know, it's, it's just very, you just have to be in the room to see it, to, to feel it, you know? 

[00:08:13] ZouZou: And it was very, it was like, you know, Le Poisson Rouge is not a big club. And, um, it was very exciting. And I could have cared less. Like, you have to understand, like, people were auto tuning my voice. They were like constantly like fixing, like, I just felt inadequate at that point. 

[00:08:27] So watching him and he sang one song like, oh, wow, he's like really off key. Like, you know what I mean? And I was like. And I don't even care. You know, it's like, there's something to be said for like, just being real and like being like, yeah, this is me hitting wrong notes here and there. And because that was so drilled into my head, like so drilled into my head that he just completely took it and smashed it on the ground, you know?

[00:08:52] And I, I needed that. Like I needed that experience when it happened. And I don't think I've been... That and Gwar actually was a big concert for me, but that's, again, it's not a band, Gwar was not a band that I even really heard of again. And, but I, again, that's another concert. 

[00:09:08] Just, I was like, what is happening here? Like, this is great. Like I felt free and just, and like I said, to me, like, I want people to feel that when they leave a Soraia show, whether it's the music or the songs or the performance only, or all those things. Great. But that's, that's like the kind of mark I want to leave. Like there's CBGB 70s, you know, time period bands that just. I'd love to have been alive doing music at that point. You know what I mean?

[00:09:37] Charles: Yeah. I've seen some of your live videos and, yeah, you're getting into it for sure. For sure.

[00:09:43] ZouZou: Some of them, some of them are just like that, but other ones, I'm just, I don't, you know, cause sometimes, um, I can share this really quick and I know this is off, uh, the question a little bit, but we opened a Joan Jett show probably like a year ago, maybe a year and a half ago now. And, there was problems with the monitors when we sound check.

[00:10:01] So we didn't get to, get like an act. Like we did a line check, but we didn't do a sound check and I was panicking. Right. And we get, we get on stage and I'm like, I asked them to turn up the guitar. And I was like, I don't know if I should ask them to turn up the guitar and the monitors, cause I never really have guitar on my monitors and I told them to turn it up and they turned it up and I couldn't hear myself anymore. And I was like, well, am I allowed to curse?

[00:10:23] Charles: Sure, go ahead. 

[00:10:24] ZouZou: I was like, fuck it. And I just went and like everybody, I thought that was probably the worst show I've ever done. And it was like, everybody came up to me. It was like, that is the best show. Like that was the, and I was like, I guess like part of it is like, you just got to not care, like not, not care at all, but like, you know, you, once you just let go and don't care, it's like, I find that it's most of the times that I hear from anyone in the audience, whether it's a very small audience or a very big audience. They always say the same thing like, that was so great. And when I think I had a great show, they're usually like, it was good. You know, never what I, think anyway. 

[00:11:01] Charles: I think that's common with a lot of things, you know, and you're just like overthink something and then everybody's like, oh, that was, that was awesome. Those are great stories. And then, you posted some pictures of you at a Bruce Springsteen concert not too long ago backstage and just like how was, as a fan, being in that kind of environment had to be kind of interesting, I would imagine.

[00:11:26] ZouZou: Well, it wasn't the first time I've been backstage at a Bruce show because, you know, we're signed to little Steven's label. So we've been, and before we were even signed to Steven's label, he was a fan of the band and he would have us come backstage. And I've been backstage with like pretty much every band member at this point.

[00:11:43] And, um, so I think our first experience had to be in 2014. Maybe 15. That's like 10 years ago at this point. But yeah, we used to, we always... Steven, you know we'd go see Steven play like we, we you know, and we'd stay on his side of the stage and watch him and sometimes eye contact stuff. But like you know, Steven's a fan of music like he's a fan of bands and um, and he's invited us backstage a number of times but this time, so this time and the time you're talking about is in Phoenix, so he had put together a whole, um, South by Southwest tour based around, like, it's going to be a South by Southwest showcase at a Continental club.

[00:12:22] We'll start the tour. Then we're going to go to Phoenix. Then we're going to Vegas, Los Angeles, San Francisco. It was like a five or six day tour. We did this in March. And so Steven planned it so that he could go both to the Phoenix show and bring some of the E Street Band with him, which he did. And then he also, and they were playing Phoenix that night.

[00:12:41] And then he also planned to be in Vegas because we played Vegas the night before Springsteen played Vegas. So he, you know, it was his tour. Wicked Cool's tour. So, um, his labels tour. And, um, So he called me and, now keep in mind, there's four bands on this bill on this tour bill, right? So it's our band, Soraia, um, Slim Jim Phantoms bands, and all its members and, um, Chesterfield Kings and all its members. And then, um, why can't I think of the fourth band is Cocktail Slipper, Cocktail Slippers and all their members. 

[00:13:12] So there's like 20 people. Right. So his people call us and we know them well. And they're like, listen, there's too many of you to bring backstage. We're going to drop you in the pit and then we're going to take you out of the pit. When it's time for you to go to your show, like we sound check, then we went to the show, and then we had to leave so we could do our show. 

[00:13:31] And our show started directly, we were the after party for the Springsteen show. So Steven came, and Steven was there the whole night, and then a couple more of them came. Uh, Clemens came and somebody else came. I forget. There were like two or three other E Street band members there. So that was the deal. And so that day I get a call from Steven and he said, So, what's the deal? Are you guys coming tonight? Is everybody coming? I said, yeah, we're all coming. Every, every band wants to come. So we're all coming to the show, which was good logistically, because we were all followed each other and parked in the right area in case anybody didn't know what to do.

[00:14:04] So he's like, okay. And so when are you getting here? And I said, well, they're going to drop us in the pit once you guys start. And then we're going to just, they'll pull us out of the pit and bring us back to our parking area, whatever. He goes, don't you want to meet Al? And I was like, I don't know what he's talking about.

[00:14:16] So I was like, of course I want to meet Al. Right. He goes, you know, Al Cooper. So I'm thinking Al Kooper with a K. Al Kooper the, the guy who did the keyboard, the song wrote and like did the keyboard solo on, Rolling Stone and a famous, he's famous, a famous musician and he lives in Phoenix. However, I did not know that Alice Cooper also lives in Phoenix. So I said, sure, we want to meet Al Cooper. He goes, well, then you're coming backstage. So we went backstage, so we get there and we get back and we're all talking, waiting for Steven to come out. It's just before they're going on.

[00:14:44] And I look to my right and I see Alice Cooper and I turn around. I'm like, to my band, I'm like, huh, I guess he meant Alice Cooper. Right. So big fan, all, a lot, all of us were big fans of Alice Cooper. So we couldn't believe it. And we're kind of like, wow. So Alice Cooper came over and with Steven and they talked to us early, talked to us for a bit and took some pictures with all of us.

[00:15:03] And then, you know, and then we went, they had, they were about to start. So we went, they pulled us out to the pit and we watched them all come on stage. And we just had a blast. Like we just have fun. Like we're just, we love to sing. We love to just hop around, you know, and, and just be. 

[00:15:20] I think every musician at their heart is a music fan. Like we, we love music or we wouldn't do it. Like think about like, why would you follow that career? It's not like, it's not like paved out. Like, okay, if you do A, B and C, you're going to be making this much money for this long. It's like, it's the most ridiculous... Like an artist has no security. And then all of a sudden they might make a ton of money and be really famous one day and the next day be like uncool, you know, it's like you can't do it for a reason.

[00:15:49] Then you're a fan of music and you're a fan of, of, of you've gotten lost in music in some way. And that's what I love about Steven in particular and about everybody on his label. They were just, we're such fans of music. So we go to the show and we have fun and just like anybody else would. And then when we had to go, we're like, ah.

[00:16:08] But I'd never actually done a show after being to a show so I was like trying not to scream or sing too loud and everything. But it was fun. I mean you're, you're a fan. Everybody's a fan of music. I think whether we're actually doing it or we're involved in a different way behind the scenes, or in the business of it, or we're just a fan going to a show, we have another type of job.

[00:16:28] It's like music is that um it's just such a release for anyone who loves to go to live shows. It's a release and we need it, you know in and in a healthy way I think most people need it in a healthy way. So, that's my experience anyway.

[00:16:42] And, and all the bands were just jumping around and having fun and we're laughing at each other and Steven laughed at us a few times. I think Bruce laughed at us too, which is ridiculous. 

[00:16:50] Charles: Yeah, that sounds like a great get-together and a way to kind of experience music. Steven Van Zandt, you know, cause he's a musician, you know, working with him on that record label, like you said, it's gotta be different than if some, some other record label where the person doesn't have that kind of background, I would imagine.

[00:17:10] ZouZou: Yeah, you, you just trust him more. Even if I don't agree with some of his production ideas, I trust him. You know and then that he was giving them the whole time like, you know, when he came to see the show he's like, he, he can be very heavily involved at times and very uninvolved at other times. And I think the artists that sign with him that stay with him are artists that like to do their own thing. Like, you know what I mean? And, and still want guidance, but they have like the freedom to be themselves. Like he's not trying to turn us into something else, which is really nice I've yet to meet anyone else that's not done that. And, and he, you know, we've been signed with him since '16? The end of '16, like October 16.

[00:17:53] And we've done three albums and numerous singles with him. And he's been involved in some of them heavily. Our first album with him, he was heavily involved in. And then, you know, other ones, he just came in and helped produce a song. We met him in, in like '13. No, I met him in '10 or '11. I don't know.

[00:18:13] Anyway, I, I just know he started work. He came to our show in New York city and then started working with us and said, do you want me to help you with your live show and make it like flow? Um, and I said, sure. So that's how we started working with him. That was in '13. So, and then we signed with him in '16, but he's like an artist's artist.

[00:18:29] It's like, you know, there's singer singers and there's artists and he'll come in and it's all on the same floor. He'll just come in. He helped. He helped us with, uh, Heartbreaker Do, Do, Do, Do, Do, Do, Do, Do, Do, Do, Do. Which is one of the first covers we ever did. And, I ever did. And, um, he came in and we were doing it like the Stones and he's like, you can't do it like the Stones.

[00:18:50] And so he came in and he changed it and it's all his production on that one. Like, and that was heavy involvement. Still, I Rise, he co wrote with me after we wrote it a different way with the band. And then he came in with me and rewrote it. It's like, and you're kind of like, when it happens, you're kind of like, there's this part of you that's like, Oh, we're going to do our thing.

[00:19:09] But then he comes in and he just makes it like, I'd say three or four months later, I realized he makes it better, you know, but at the time you're kind of like, I like it this way. And then you like, trust him enough. I don't think we would survive if it was like a corporate environment, which a lot of major labels are.

[00:19:27] I always think there's a lot less fear working with him than there is probably in other situations. 

[00:19:33] Charles: Yeah, well then you trust him and then you're also open to that kind of feedback, which like you said, it's hard at first to kind of take it like, well, I don't know, I kind of like the way it is, but then, you know, after living with it for a little bit, you're like, you know, I think he had a point there. 

[00:19:51] ZouZou: And it's hard. Like everybody, it's, it's subjective. It's like not like really I might like something and he might not like it and he might it's like I do this on a daily when we write songs, we we have to, if we're not married to the idea, we have to be willing to try. 

[00:20:07] There's five people in our band. Like you can't always get your way. You can't. And I will fight to the death if I believe something should be a certain way. But I'm talking about from a drum beat which, you know, Brianna has a lot to do with, and then maybe I have ideas and, and, you know, at times some of us come to the table and we're open to ideas and other times we're not and then we have to just go back at it again.

[00:20:29] But it is a lot more of a commitment than people realize when you're in a group situation and not a solo artist situation. You have a lot of people who have a lot of opinions. They want to be heard and also want their ideas. 

[00:20:41] Charles: Yeah, ZouZou, I just want to just briefly touch on some of your earlier stuff. Like Dirty Like Soraia, some of the earlier things. I, they kind of have a different sound, which is more keyboards I hear in those, uh, albums with, I think the guy's name's Jack Barachino. Is that correct? 

[00:21:01] ZouZou: Jack Faraccio. He's, he's not on Dirty Like Soraia. Dirty Like Soraia is pure punk, but he was on, um, in the Valley of Love and Guns. And, no, he wasn't on the Valley of Love and Guns. He was only on Soraia Lives, which was '14. And, um, ' 17, Dead Reckoning, which we did with Wicked Cool. And we have Keith, we replaced well, he had wanted to go do his own thing and we got a guy John Hildenbrand after that, who did most of the work with us and still works with us, here and there. He's not a permanent member, but on the recordings, he's always he's always there.

[00:21:36] Charles: Okay. Cause I thought Dirty like Soraia is kind of like a punk version of The Pretenders or something. It, it's a really cool sound. So, I'd encourage people to check that out when they're looking at your, your most recent stuff too, and you guys have quite a extensive catalog actually, and we'll, we'll talk about that in a, in a bit. 

[00:21:57] But, your most, uh, recent albums, let's say, Dead Reckoning, Dig Your Roots, and Bloom, you described those as like a trilogy of sorts. At least the titles represent different things for you as a band and, and as a songwriter. Did you want to talk about that a little bit? How you, how you see those three albums?

[00:22:21] ZouZou: Yeah, sure. I, I mean, um, I didn't intentionally and we didn't intentionally set out to do a trilogy of anything, but what I realized after writing Bloom, um, so I'm the lyricist. I don't write any of the music. I only write the lyrics and the melodies and Travis writes most of the music. And then we also have other writers come in here and there.

[00:22:44] Like I think on Bloom, it's only me and Travis actually, but on, um, Dead Reckoning, Steven wrote one and, on Dig Your Roots, me and Steven wrote one. And then, who else wrote? There was, on Dead Reckoning, we, the guitarist we had was our permanent guitar player at the time. And we co-wrote a couple on that one. And I think on Dig Your Roots, one or two. And Brianna and I wrote one on Dig Your Roots as well. But Travis and I are the main writers. We've just done it for a while. We've, we're in a good groove of doing things. I respond well to his musical ideas and a lot to his musical ideas. 

[00:23:21] So what we do is when we finish the, the actual recording of the album, then they ask us for the title. And that's when I start reading the lyrics and deciding what the title is. And the band really gives that to me because it's the lyrics that kind of define the, for us, the lyrics are what define the title. Like we, I get, I get the title from the theme that I see coming out in the lyrics. And as I'm writing the songs, I don't have a theme. I just have ideas. And then I sit down and I'll listen to Travis's music. He sent me. And then I go, huh, I have a great idea. Like I have words that come to his music, which is why I like writing with him. 

[00:24:00] So what I did is on Dead Reckoning, that was very clearly a lot of songs we'd written over a period, a lot more longer period of time because we had signed with the label, our back catalog, and then we had already had all these songs written, most of them, except maybe two or three that ended up on Dead Reckoning.

[00:24:18] And so it wasn't so much a writing process as, as much as just recording that, capturing the, the, the spirit of our live show on our vinyl, on a recording and produced really well with Jeff Sanoff and Steven. So, I realized Dead Reckoning was kind of, there was a statement in it that seemed like it was about my past and where I'd been to where I was today, but I didn't really know where I was going.

[00:24:43] And there was a term called dead reckoning that a ship uses when it doesn't have actual navigation, but it knows where it's been and navigates from where it's been to where it needs to be. So I was like, well, that's dead reckoning, you know, and it's funny because, there was like some internal arguing about that, that topic, but that, that, that, um, title, but it was very clear that there was like, octopus was a very big thing for us.

[00:25:06] And like, it's just, those things come to you. It's almost like come from the stratosphere and just, you realize what this album needs visually, what it needs, titlewise, so Dead Reckoning was the first in the series. And then the next one was Dig Your Roots. And a lot of that, what I found out at when I was listening back was about me.

[00:25:24] I'm realizing that I hid a lot of who I was growing up. I had a Muslim father, and I had a Christian mother, and both my parents were older when they had me. So I hid a lot of things about that. Because honestly, because of the culture that I was growing up in and I didn't need people to know it.

[00:25:42] So, I had this like weird shame that was just mine. Nobody put it on me. It was just for me, I had like a shame about who I was. Like, I didn't really show people all of who I was. I didn't let people get too close either. And so I realized when I listened back to the lyrics on all these songs, I was like, Oh, I think I'm like, I don't care anymore, like I'm letting myself be myself and I'm saying what I need to say, and not based on that particular topic, but on, I was opening up. 

[00:26:09] So I was like, Oh, I I'm starting to dig my roots. And then, and it was also about letting go. A lot of it was about letting go of people that I, that I loved that didn't work anymore in my life. Like, I mean, just didn't... We didn't see eye to eye or we just couldn't get along and we just argued a lot and we just a lot of leaving, the songs were a lot about leaving especially the one I wrote with Brianna, which is called Don't Have You. 

[00:26:31] And I was like, so I think it's about digging your roots and the kind of, not to be like too teacherly, but dichotomy of like the idea of digging your roots, like I appreciate them, like as a verb, like I dig my, who I am, like kind of that term. So digging your roots out and putting them where they, they feel like they're with their tribe. 

[00:26:47] And a lot of this too is about like, we were struggling financially and I was like, well, this is what we got to do. Like, I'm not going to quit this to be, go sit at a desk. I can't do it. Like I'll, I'll die there. At least here I'll survive. So, there was a lot going on. I feel like that album in particular, there was a song on it called Superman is gone, which is the idea that somebody is going to come along and save us, you know, and, uh, and, and we're going to like strike gold and one song is going to make us 3 million trillion dollars.

[00:27:18] It's like, becoming realistic about what artistry really meant for each of us individually as well, and what we knew we'd be OK with and what we wouldn't be okay with. So, um, I think at that point we really started bonding and realizing we were going to stay together and not try to do separate things.

[00:27:35] With Bloom, it was a really, not to be corny, but it was a really beautiful way that title came. It's like, I knew that listening back to those songs, that I was the artist I was meant to be like, I'm still going to grow, right, but I was, I had shed all that crap and like, whoever I thought I was supposed to be, what I was supposed to like, act like, look like, sing, like, be like, I was like, this is my voice. This is who I am. You're either going to love me or hate me, but I'm cool with it either way. Cause I know that's exactly, I've, I've done the work I've done the, the. The soul searching. I'm as every album just gets more and more honest. So, I had like this acceptance moment and I was like, and for me in Bloom was like one of my favorite pieces of work musically. 

[00:28:21] I'm a big Nirvana fan, and I also kept thinking how Bloom, like a lot of people were suggesting just call it Soraia then. Like Soraia, like it was called the one, I'm the view, it's called Soraia. And I was like, I like that too, but we went to Sweden and we were touring Sweden and I kept seeing the word bloom literally everywhere. I'm not even lying to you. Everywhere I turned, there was graffiti that said bloom. There were images that said bloom. I like, it just was everywhere. And I was like, no, that's too weird. Like it's supposed to be called Bloom. And so that was Bloom. 

[00:28:56] And I realized, looking back I had Dead Reckoning, which was like, I don't know where I'm going, but I know where I've been not going that way. So I'm going that way. Dig Your Roots. Understanding that like there's no set place you're supposed to be you just follow whatever, and then Bloom was like It's all kind of there was even like kind of a whole garden feeling. Water, garden like earth kind of stuff which always appealed to me. So I felt like I said what I needed to say And let's see where we go from here. 

[00:29:23] Charles: You guys are working on a new album, right? Are you writing material for the new album? I thought I heard you mention that, in that, uh, Instagram, video recently. 

[00:29:33] ZouZou: It's a very big time for writing. We, we did a few tours in March and April and then now we're just and they were short but they were enough to like, you know, you're, you're focusing on that and learning songs and like, you know, working on the show a little bit.

[00:29:47] So, we didn't get to write as much. I'd started three or four songs and one particular one I'm really feeling. So, I actually listened to them after we got back this past, our last show was Sunday. So Monday I was listening to some ideas, just, you know, chilling out listening. And I was like, man, these are going to be good.

[00:30:04] So we only have like, like one show in June and then we have like a tour in July, but then fall, we hit hard and I'd like to have like a few new songs by then. Plus we might go record a few in August. But, like either way it's writing time and we already started, so, we're just going to continue and really delve and dig into that instead of worry about like live performance for the next few months.

[00:30:27] Charles: I think you had mentioned, well, like you're toying with the idea of calling Bloom, Soraia, do you think you might like this next album? I know you have to wait till you kind of hear everything and come up with a title, but do you think that might be the title of it? maybe a culmination or a bringing together of everything so far from the past, you know, up until the present.

[00:30:50] ZouZou: I mean, it might be. It's usually, like I said, it's like, really, we wait aside till the end because it's a body of work, you know, versus like, what I might start writing and what I've see our theme seems to be right now for these first three or four that may or may not make the album, let's be honest. Probably at least one of them I know definitely will because I feel strongly about it and we all feel strongly about this one particular one. 

[00:31:14] It really depends kind of at the end when I really just listen to what I was writing about. I think like my biggest thing as I was thinking I was like, am I struggling with writing right now? I'm like not at all, but I'm, I'm so hyper focused on this one theme that I feel like I have to get a little distance from it to really write about it. And then going on the road last week really helped because we tour with this band, the Idiot Kids. We usually do. I love them and they love us and we just, it's just easy tours and we love working together.

[00:31:44] But the one, the singer of that band is a songwriter and he was talking to me about a few things. I'm like, man, I'm so ready to write now. You know, I got to just sit down and do it. There's always fear. And the fears usually I don't have anything worthwhile to say, or I'm not going to say it the way I want to say it.

[00:32:01] Like some kind of weird perfection ego thing is usually in the way every time before I sit down. But once I sit down, it just flows. And I've been reading a lot, you know, and poetry always kind of like sparks ideas. So, it's coming. It's ruminating.

[00:32:16] Charles: We'll look forward to that for sure. If we could switch gears for a second here, ZouZou. I wanted to talk about your fans, your fan base, or just fans in general. And one in particular, , we had on, this is how we kind of connected with you, was through, one of your fans, Dawn Fontaine, was on the first episode of our second season here at Seeing Them Live. I know you had listened to that episode and her story was so powerful that, you know, she literally says that your music, your performances and your interactions with her, literally saved her life. Just briefly, you know, what kind of impact did that have on you, and or the band when you hear something like that?

[00:33:05] ZouZou: I feel like that's what music did for me. I think it's a beautiful thing and I, I don't take credit for it. Like I go, she heard the message she was supposed to hear when she heard it. And we happen to be the medium of her hearing it. Like, I don't ever get pompous about that.

[00:33:19] I don't ever get pompous about like the gift of songwriting either. I'm, I cultivated it and I did the hard work, but I, I know that that's. To me, a God given thing. And I, I'm a strong believer in higher power and whatever your religion, I don't, it doesn't, that doesn't apply. It's really just that I know, you know, all my job is to do what I do.

[00:33:41] You share my experience and share my hope. Some of us have been given a second chance at life, you know what I mean? And that's what I have to share. Like, I can't make up that experience and I can't not be the underdog. That's who I am. Like, that's, and I think that speaks to people. 

[00:33:57] There was a guy who came to our show and said, I had my suit laid out and was ready to commit suicide. All my notes written and your song Jolene saved my life. And I think that's the first time I ever heard that and I realized the power of, that it's not for me. Like I don't I think what I realized when I hear that It's first of all, we love Dawn.

[00:34:23] I mean we love Dawn. Anyway, uh Dawn is like us so that's why we love her not because we saved her life or our music saved her life is because she's a fan and she gives to us as much as we give to her. Like, literally, like, there's no way we would keep doing it. Otherwise, we didn't hear that story. It wouldn't help us on dark days when we want to quit or we can't pay for my cat to eat.

[00:34:46] I don't care if I eat my cat doesn't eat. There's a problem in the world. So, like, literally. You know, it gets us through stuff too, and we're just darker people. We've been through stuff. We've been through a lot of stuff and I think that resonates with people who have been through stuff, you know what I mean?

[00:35:03] It doesn't resonate with people who aren't ready to look at that. Like Iggy doesn't, would not have resonated with me 10 years before I saw him. But I saw him at the right place, the right time. And I saw him literally one time live. And it changed my life, saved my life, probably. Saved me from a career that would've killed me, to be honest.

[00:35:23] And that's not why I got into music, I had to remember that. So when I hear stuff like that, I think I have more in common with her than she probably realizes. I said the same thing to Joan Jett. I know when I met her, I said, you saved my life. And I said, why would you say that to somebody? And I realized, I'm like, well, it's fine.

[00:35:45] Like these people did save my life. Music is going to keep saving people's lives. Songs, whether it be a song, a band, a band's story, a movie. That's art. That's why we need art. Like, it's, it's really that simple. But, her story did affect me and, you know, it was funny because she loves Still I Rise and we almost never do that live.

[00:36:08] So we did it last tour, she's like, she came up and she's like, did you see me? And I was like, no, I had my eyes closed. I'm trying to remember all the words. Like, so many words. 

[00:36:18] It's funny. It's like, I'm not, absolutely not trying to say that's smaller than anything. It's huge. It's a huge thing. But what I am trying to say is certain music hits us when we're supposed to hear it. And I, that's again, something bigger than. Than me or her or us or any of us. It's like, if you're ready to hear it, what's it saying if you when you're ready the teacher appears. That's what I feel like music has always done and will continue to do as long as people can keep doing it. 

[00:36:47] Douglas: ZouZou, I just thought I'd interject. One of my favorite sayings, I actually carry this around in my wallet, and it's a saying by Stella Adler, who was a acting coach. And she said something along the lines of "life will always break down your soul, but art will remind you that you have one." And that always spoke to me. And I think that kind of is along the same lines of what you've been saying.

[00:37:12] ZouZou: Yeah. I mean that it goes back to when, when we first started our conversation and like, you know, we're fans of music. Like when I, when I saying about Bruce Springsteen, I was like, we're fans. Like, you know, like we're all fans of music and we're, there's some, sometimes we don't feel it for a long time.

[00:37:28] Then all of a sudden we've all related to this, right? As a song we listened to like over and over, like on repeat or an album or an artist, and then all of a sudden we have nothing to do it. And then we refind them and we hear them differently, right? Because it's art. Like, I mean, I never was affected going, I live right near the art museum in Philadelphia, never was affected by paintings, swear to God. I go like recently and I'm like, Oh my God. Cause I was like, what am I supposed to feel when I look at this? That's how I spent my life looking at paintings. Sometimes how I read poetry in high school, how I read poetry.

[00:38:00] I didn't get into poetry until after high school. I looked at it as a chore and hard. And then I found poetry that affected me. I found Langston Hughes Suicide's Note. "The calm, cool face of the river offered me a kiss." That was the whole poem. And I got chills down my spine from reading that. And I thought, like, you know what I mean? And some people hate that, like, hate it. Like, they're like, no, that's wrong. It shouldn't be right. That's terrible. And other people are just like, all right, cool. It changed me, like, you know, that's have to be anything. It's just, you know, that's what art does. Just like you said.

[00:38:31]

[00:38:32] Charles: Speaking of fans, I, thought maybe we could touch on this term "super fan" being thrown around by marketing people on social media and how musicians and fans don't like to be referred to as super fans, which I thought was kind of goofy. I never took offense to somebody calling me a super fan of, of whomever. I just wondered, do you have a take on that as like, as far as marketing or putting people on this, I don't know, fan continuum and trying to measure, you know, a fan, let's say, and how, how much of a fan they are. Since you're a musician and and been with it for a long time, if you had a perspective on that.

[00:39:18] ZouZou: I feel like I don't mind being called a super fan of anything, because I am a super fan of a lot of things. Sometimes I'm just a fan of a song, but like, for instance, like Elvis Presley and Prince, I'm not going to say I'm their biggest fan because that's not possible, but I am a super fan.

[00:39:34] Like, you can't say anything wrong about either of them to me without hearing, you know, a lot of evidence that you're incorrect. You know what I mean? And it's opinion, right? So I'm like, who am I to say you're wrong? Like, but I will, I will, like, I'll defend them to the death. And so, because I'll be like, oh, but Elvis can sing everything.

[00:39:52] Like, he can sing these things with the same, like, heart that he sings like a folk song like he can take a Bob Dylan song and make it like, you know I mean like so but, but I also get tripped up on my super fandom. But I like the term super fan and I think that's again personal It's like some people might not like to be called a super fan.

[00:40:11] I think some people like to be considered more of a friend of the band sometimes I think at the level we're at, we're interacting a lot more. So they're, they have more access to us. So it's like, it's a weird dynamic when you're like, well, they're a fan, but they're some of them turn into friends. Some of them are just acquaintances, you know what I mean?

[00:40:28] It's always something when I speak to people, I used to, I always address people as our, in posts or whatever, as our friends and fans, because I feel like if you call some people, fans are like, well, I'm not just a fan. I'm a friend too. Like, you know, they get, and not that I'm going to walk on eggshells cause I don't really care.

[00:40:46] Like, you know, if you're going to get offended about that, like, please. But I do also, as a fan, I like to hear that. Cause some people know so much about our band that I don't even know. Like they heard songs. I don't even, I'm like, did we do that song? Like, really? We write so much.

[00:41:02] Like, I don't even know, like we've, I found a song that, a demo of ours when I moved and I was like, I don't even remember recording that song. I kind of know I did it cause my voice is on it, but I don't remember it. So it's like, it's kind of nice too. So that's how I feel from a musician perspective towards that term.

[00:41:19] I can also tell you that there's some people that no matter what I put on our merch site, it is gone in a second. Those people just eat it up and they've never come to a show.

[00:41:28] Charles: Oh, wow. Okay.

[00:41:30] ZouZou: Oh, it's like, they only heard us through the medium of the song, recorded music. So I never seen a live show of ours. And then there are some fans who don't buy our stuff, but they'll come to every single show. They'll follow us. It's like, how do you look at it? I don't know. There's certain people I know better than others because I just see them more or their name pops up.

[00:41:48] And I handle the merch along with someone else. So it's like, you know, I'll get the email and they'll say, man, I've been following you, I wish you would come to Utah or something. You know what I mean? Like, I'd be like, you know what? We're to play and maybe we will. Like, but, um, know, so I, I get to see all that stuff. So I just go like, we have all sorts of levels of super fans that may not ever be to been at a show. 

[00:42:12] Charles: That's a great way of putting it. I think you nailed it as far as fandom goes, and just the different facets of it. And speaking of fans ZouZouzu, Soraia fans, I like your website. It's really laid out well. It's, it's great. 

[00:42:30] ZouZou: I'm so glad you said that. Not to interrupt, but I'm interrupting on you. 

[00:42:33] Charles: Go ahead. 

[00:42:34] ZouZou: This has been on my mind. I'm like, we need to redo our website and so you're saying you like it. I'm like, maybe we don't need to redo our website just yet.

[00:42:42] Charles: I found it easy to navigate 'cause some, on some bands, I can't find what I'm looking for and it, and it might be somewhere else. Yeah, your site's like, once you get there, you can find your way around and stuff, but I wanted you to talk about the Soraia vault that you, you guys have, and it's like, there's different levels of the vault and it's like, go ahead and just kind of describe what that is. 

[00:43:06] ZouZou: So, it kind of goes off of what I just said about finding that song. Right? So I was doing this big move in August of '23, from Jersey to like, pretty much like. The hood part of Philadelphia, which I really like being here and other people call it the hood. I don't call it the hood. So, I mean, I'm in Philadelphia. 

[00:43:28] And I was in the middle of this move and I had a basement in my old place and I had all this Soraia stuff. Like keep in mind, there's a lot of Soraia stuff on computers that I just can't access anymore like old pictures, old recordings, old demos. But I have a lot of stuff like in my basement on CDs and pictures, live concerts, concerts other people recorded and then gave us the disc for in like 2014, 2015.

[00:43:55] So I'm looking through the stuff like I'm getting rid of a lot of stuff because I moved to a smaller place and I was like I wasn't looking at like my ugly baby pictures anymore. I was kind of like, Oh, remember when we did this? Like, oh, we were babies. Like, so I was like, huh. 

[00:44:09] Brianna and Travis give me more ideas than people probably even know, and Travis was just like, you should like, people want this. Like, don't you want your, like, I remember listening to demos of the 50 takes that Elvis did to get to the final take of, which I think he ended up taking, like one of the early ones anyway, of, of, of, Jailhouse Rock. I probably listen to those demos, like literally all 50 of them just to hear what the difference was, for weeks.

[00:44:34] Right. And I've done the same thing with like Nirvana demos or, or live shows of bands I actually played with. Like, that was like the most fun thing when I started playing live shows is like the other bands we played with and they give us their desk and I listen in the car and like stuff like that. 

[00:44:49] So I was like, people probably want this. So, and I think people had actually said that to me, like, where's, I found this. Or I found that like over the years, people like, Oh, I found this couldn't believe, why did you ever not release that? Or whatever happened to those demos you did with Billy Falcon? I'm like, I never released them. Right. So I was like, you know what we're going to do?

[00:45:05] We're going to do a vault series for the super fan, like the super fans who want that. We're never going to release those songs. Cause there was, there's still like, you know, still like in demo form, even if they're like studio demos, they're just, you know, and there's just, It's like Love Like Voodoo, we'd probably like the, the newest vault is actually like double demos of like, we did like 50 demos of, of Love Like Voodoo. One has a harmonica solo on it. I'm like, I don't even know who played that harmonica. It's fantastic. But like, I would love to get that. 

[00:45:34] So like, so we decided the end of last year after I moved, I said, let's, let's, when we finished touring, which is early November, I said, let's put together, let's see how much music we can actually release and we'll release CDs. I bet people like this. And I said, let's try it. Let's test it. And we'll do boxing day, the day after Christmas. We'll offer it. We'll open it up and see how many people are interested. And if not enough, then we won't do it. But we're like, we can just put it together.

[00:46:02] Travis masters it really quickly. Like he just brings everything up. Cause it's all different levels, you know, but live shows like early songs that you can't even, some of these songs we only did live, you never even. So I keep like, there's so many ideas coming to me right now, but so we released on boxing day and the top tiers, you get like all the CDs, but you also get a booklet because we're artists and we each do a booklet or one of us does the artwork. One of us does the discussion. 

[00:46:30] Our first one was on Egypt because I went, I'm from my, my dad's from Egypt and my family, my dad's family's in Egypt and I go almost every year. And so I was in Egypt and I was like, I'll write about like, like Hathor, like how amazing she is and the goddess and that she was in human form and like, they, they named... Anyway, it was interesting. So I was like, So Brianna did the artwork for it. And then this next one, Brianna did a comic. 

[00:46:56] Charles: Yeah. I saw that. That's really well done. 

[00:46:59] ZouZou: Yeah. They're artists. Travis and Brianna are really good artists. I'm the business. They're the artistry. I mean, I can still draw pretty good cartoon and I take art classes all the time. I love art, but I'm not going to sit down and do what they do. I, I'll do it with a song. So we offered them that and then special YouTube stuff and at the end of the year, a late cut, of two of the songs, you know, back and front, like a unique thing that only they're going to get.

[00:47:23] Because what we found with a lot of our fans, in particular, is they like that exclusive thing that nobody else has. So, and we only have enough if we're only going to get a certain amount of people to do it. We'll make 100 CDs every time. And that's the limit of what we can actually do for the vault.

[00:47:38] If there seems to be a lot of interest by the end of this year as well. We'll, we'll do another 1 next year with other demos, like, more modern demos. So we already started it and we already released two. We released a bootleg at the end of November last year, which really wasn't part of the vault, but that's what kind of spurred it because people bought up that bootleg, like in the first night, I think we got rid of all copies within three nights.

[00:48:02] And just self promoting on our own websites, not out to anybody just because it's our fans we're appealing to. So, that's when we decided to do it. And the first one was like live tracks from like 2006 and seven or eight. 

[00:48:17] Charles: Oh wow. 

[00:48:18] ZouZou: Oh, they're old. And, and like when we very first started, like when we were like, none of these people were in the band, I think Travis and I were just in the band and you know, just playing clubs and we had the board recordings and people loved it.

[00:48:30] And they found other bands from it. Like we had a, we did a cover of Concrete Blonde Bloodletting, which we at the time had done because it was Halloween, but it became like live people, like lost their minds to it and people that heard it on the vault where like I found, I never knew who Concrete Blonde was.

[00:48:47] I was like, well, you're welcome. So, so, and then the next one we just did was all alternate. The second, this is actually the third one we're on now. So the second one was all these studio demos we did for In the Valley of Love and Guns that were never released. Like songs I co-wrote with Jon Bon Jovi, songs I co-wrote with Billy Falcon. And I was like, people are going to love this one. I love that one. But I still seem to like the first one better. At least I got more response from the first one. 

[00:49:12] And this one that's coming out this month is, like I said, alternate versions of certain songs that we have recorded. And then there's a couple of songs that have never been released. What's It For is one of them. But, you know, I try to do again, a theme with these too, but like, sometimes I rush, so I just flop them together, but basically they receive them every couple of months. The first one went out in February and then the other one, November, then February and then this one is coming out, but like, we already ordered it.

[00:49:42] So it'll be in the mail probably in a week. So, they'll get it, like, what, like, third week of the month, fourth week of the month and then the next one come out late July and then there'll be another one in October. So there's like five I think total and then the late cut that comes. 

[00:49:56] So it's really, and a lot of people are, that are, were at the hundred dollar tier upping it to the $250. But there's only a few of those left like at this point because we can't give, again, it causes money to make those, those booklets and so it's you know for what we offered it, for it really was, basically making very little profit with postage and everything else. It was really, almost not measuring up to the work that we did to do it, but it really isn't for that.

[00:50:24] It's really just to see if people like it and want to keep doing it. We'll keep doing it cause we're always writing. So you're always going to have more material, more live shows and stuff like that. So it's one for us because it's making us realize our roots as well and that we are like really prolific and we are really artistic. It's nice to like, we're discovering stuff too. So it's really nice.

[00:50:47] Charles: Yeah. I mean, you say you're prolific because when I was doing research for this interview, I mean, you go down some Soraia rabbit holes. There's all sorts of stuff out there and, and the vault would, I could see kind of collect that because, you know, there's so many singles you guys have done and or covers and such.

[00:51:06] You have such a deep catalog. Doug, you were telling me, uh, what cover song did you just, listen to of Soraia?

[00:51:14] Douglas: Two that I liked that you did was My Sharona and Black Magic Woman. I'm in a band too. I play bass in a band and we just do cover songs. So I can certainly appreciate the attraction to doing your own take on a cover song, and I really like those two.

[00:51:32] Charles: To that point Doug, I did not hear that My Sharona cover. 

[00:51:36] ZouZou: That one is, we did that in Sweden. We recorded it in Sweden. I was just singing in the car to that one. I was like, we should redo this one. And if I can be honest about it at the time, I literally, we were leaving for Sweden and we always do two songs more in Sweden. We always record a cover and one of Sulu's songs, who's a producer out there.

[00:51:55] And so far we've gone to Sweden three times. We recorded two songs every time. And the first one we did was My Sharona. And it was because literally, we were leaving and it was within the week, and I was like, Oh my God, I never picked a cover song. And Travis had shared a, a, song with me by a band called Tropical Fuckstorm.

[00:52:15] Charles: Hmm. Okay.

[00:52:15] ZouZou: That's the name of the band. And the song is a cover of the Bee Gees. And it's almost exactly like, I forget which song it is too, but look up Tropical Fuckstorm and it's a Bee Gees cover. And um, It is fantastic, but it is almost exactly, there's no change to the song in terms of structure arrangement, like, like what's being, how it's being sung melody, nothing except a different voice. And, but it's a hundred times different than the original. And, and it's, it doesn't even matter. It's done exactly like the original, except even the guitar solo is kind of hysterical. It's just different. 

[00:52:49] And I was like, you know what? My Sharon is such an iconic song. There's no way we're going to make it our own. Except for the scream. People love my scream. So I was like, that's what I'm going to put into it. And that's exactly why I wanted to do it. And I was like, you guys want to do My Sharona next week when we record? And I'm like, yeah, sure. And it was like that simple. And it's still one of my favorite covers that we record. Like when we were recording, it was just so fun. Like it was easy. There's no, like, nobody's really overthinking it. It just added weird stuff to it. 

[00:53:21] And Black Magic Woman was a Brianna decision and Brianna is amazing on harmony. She did like seven different harmonies for those voices and she had to teach me three. And I was like, we're never going to be able to do this live because we don't have enough voices playing anything. But we've done it, we did it when it came out live, we haven't done it since. But that one was totally her baby and her creation, cause I would never have touched that one either.

[00:53:47] And then, I felt like I couldn't sing it like she did it and was very haunting. But then when I played, I sat down with one day and I was like, oh, I think I got something and then we recorded it. 

[00:53:56] Charles: Yeah. I heard in an interview, you said you have enough cover songs to make an album, of just cover songs. 

[00:54:04] ZouZou: Probably two. And we want to do another one. I was like, let's do a cover EP and they're like what? I was like, I don't know

[00:54:11] Charles: Yeah. I'll have to check out the My Sharona. I did not find that. So we're kind of getting to the end here, ZouZou. Doug wanted to touch on some of the horror themes in your music. I'd read or heard that you're a big, Edgar Allen Poe fan. And I know the video, I Seek Fire was, uh..., 

[00:54:31] ZouZou: A horror story. 

[00:54:32] Charles: Yeah. Some horror story going on there too. I mean, I think he, it says it right at the beginning of the video, but, yeah, he was just, Doug was just curious as to your love for, that genre.

[00:54:43] Douglas: I'm a big fan of Wednesday, the series on Netflix. And I thought of that when I saw the look and feel that you seem to be projecting with that. I was just wondering what, what kind of a choice was involved with that.

[00:54:54] ZouZou: It's funny, there's a period because Travis and Brianna are very into horror and I'm like, I'm not like as into horror as you guys are. And they're like, okay, you know, they always say that to me. Like, they're like, have you looked in the mirror? Like, I'm like, I just like that. Look, like, I like that. Like, I love, like, that look, like, that's always appealed to me and I've always been, if I'm 100 percent transparent about something, I've always been worried that because we're not a goth band and we're not like a horror band, you know what I mean? So, I'm like, Oh my God, I think our image is putting forth like an idea that we're something we're not like, you know what I mean? I was, and there was like, who cares? I was like, yeah, that's true. 

[00:55:32] It was funny. I always go back to this. My father, when I was probably a 12 year old, I was, cause I was preteen and I remember he'd take me to the, if he'd take me to go shopping or something like clothes, he'd be like, why don't you ever pick any colors?

[00:55:46] And I'm like, what? He's like, you always pick black. And I was like, no I don't. And I went home and I looked in my closet. It was all black. And I was like, I always pick black. Like it wasn't like a scooling choice. It was literally I just loved black. 

[00:56:02] And, um, so I, I always think it starts then I've been terrified of horror movies my whole life. Like, I'm talking about, like, possession movies or witch movies. I can't watch horror movies unless I'm with my band. Like, I won't go see The Omen. There's no way I'm going to see that. Like, I can't. I can't handle it. Like, I'll have a meltdown. Like, I won't sleep for weeks. My head is crazy. 

[00:56:22] Like, I can't, I watched The Jinx the other day and I couldn't sleep. I had every light on. It's like, this is not even, that guy's dead. Like, you know what I mean? But anyway, I don't really know why I'm attracted to like the darker side of things. Like fashion wise, I've always been attracted to darker, more mysterious people, clothing wise, house wise, image wise, like if you see some of those images over there, but they're like, they're just strange to me.

[00:56:50] I like the strange, and I like curious and I think because there's some, it's like a good poem. Like you have to think about it for a minute. Like it's not so on the nose as the one guy who did our horror videos always says, like, it's too on the nose. Don't wear that. It's too on the nose. I'm like, what?

[00:57:08] It's too obvious. Like, I like a little more depth to things. And to me, horror has so many depths. Like, a really good horror movie has depth. And then there's the gore horror movie that's just equally as interesting. It's like, wow, why would you just, like, we went to see the original Friday the 13th in the theater. It came out last summer. They kill Kevin Bacon in it and I was just like, wow. And I know I just totally went off target, but, but like, I like old, like, I can't, this is the best way I can say that sums up how I love horror. 

[00:57:37] The original Halloween is incredibly boring to me, but I will watch it on repeat. Cause there's something about the old, I shouldn't say old, it's not that old, but like, kind of, pre-internet stuff. Like the way films were done and simpler and like, it appeals to me. 

[00:57:57] And for our videos, I Seek Fire and Tight-Lipped. I actually worked with a horror guy. He's not a horror guy, but he's attracted to horror. It's a, it's a director who I love his name. Sam Shapson. And I would explain to him what the song was about and he took it and turned it into a horror theme every time. And I was like, I like it. Like, I like it. I like the idea of somebody being a victim and at the end coming out the victor. Like, you know what I mean? And the last video we did, I Seek Fire, we meant to be a continuation. I don't know when we're going to do part two, but it ends, if you watch the I Seek Fire video, it ends with a cliffhanger. 

[00:58:29] Charles: The hand comes alive. 

[00:58:30] ZouZou: The guy comes alive at the end. I've been trying to make come to life the entire stupid thing. I'm like, taking, buying like, stuff from witch doctors and like, I'm like, throwing like, pieces of intestine around like, wood, strange sage things. And like, and I'm just like, it's not working, and I get upset, and I, and I'm leaving, and he comes to life, right? 

[00:58:53] So, that's how it ends. So the idea in the next video was supposed to be, which we still have, like I said, when we write this album, we'll do a video with them again. And it'll be that part too.

[00:59:03] But it's, it's just, to me, I love acting and stuff like that. I love like the mystery and I love the anti hero theme. I'm just, I, I find that most of my friends are horror people and I don't know how that happened. Like, you know what I mean? Like, they just, and I think it's like people who've been through stuff, find some solace in horror.

[00:59:21] Like, they really do. They find like, they identify with it. Like, to me, I watch Nightmare Before Christmas. I totally identify with Jack Skellington and Sally, Sally, right? Sally. I can't remember her name anymore. Because their loneliness, there's a loneliness to being like overthinking or, you know, or trying to figure something out or, or being committed to art. Like there's a bit of a loneliness to that. And I think that's what horror has to it. Like, you know what I mean?

[00:59:48] Charles: Yeah. I could see that. Yeah. Definitely.

[00:59:50] ZouZou: And I don't mean lonely in a bad way. I mean, because you find plenty of people who are like you. I mean, but, but in a, um, I don't know if lonely was the right word, I don't want to say isolative, but you see things differently. 

[01:00:04] Charles: Yeah. 

[01:00:05] ZouZou: Horror's kind of cool to me. All kinds of horror. Except Possession. Can't, can't watch possessions.

[01:00:10] Charles: Yeah, those movies creep me out too. Well, ZouZou, I think we're coming up on time here and I know Doug and I, and some people are planning on going to that Soraia show in Chicago on September 20th, at the Liar's Club in Chicago, 

[01:00:28] ZouZou: Love that club. Have you ever been to Liar's club? 

[01:00:31] Charles: No, I was gonna say, did you guys play there? You've been throughhicago before, I would imagine, right?

[01:00:36] ZouZou: Yeah, a number of times. That club is really cool. Gary Kessler, owns it. Gary Kessler manages it. And he is the most, you'll just have to look at his shoes. Cause he always has the coolest shoes, but the club is like, you can tell whoever owns it as a Kiss fan, and also just a music fan because it's one of those clubs, it's completely covered in like paraphernalia. In a very cool way. It's, it's got a very cool vibe and the sound is really good. And everybody comes up to the front. It's, it's such a great experience there. I love Liar's Club.

[01:01:06] Charles: Okay. Yeah, I'm looking, looking forward to it. I've never been there, but, what I was going to mention to you too, uh, well, you've been to Chicago several times and I heard in an interview, you, your favorite grilled food is the hot dog. 

[01:01:18] ZouZou: Yeah. 

[01:01:19] Charles: So, in doing my research, there's one of the top 10 hot dog places in Chicago. It's called the Wiener Circle. 

[01:01:27] ZouZou: What? 

[01:01:27] Charles: And it's like a 15 minute drive from the Liar's Club. So if you want to check that out.

[01:01:32] ZouZou: Yeah, I do. I love hot dogs. I don't know what my problem is with that. I'm addicted though. Cause I had, I get like, oh, I'm going to eat a hot. It's like a gift.

[01:01:41] Charles: I know. 

[01:01:42] Douglas: Who doesn't like hot dogs?

[01:01:43] Charles: Right. Exactly. Especially Chicago style hot dogs. It's called the Wiener's Circle. It's like a 15 minute car ride from Liar's Club. So, you'll have to check it out if you have time. 

[01:01:56] ZouZou: Oh I'll, I'll find time..

[01:01:57] Charles: So, uh, is there anything ZouZou you'd like to plug or something we should mention or where people can find you. I know you're on Instagram quite a bit. 

[01:02:08] ZouZou: Yeah. you can. Soraia Rocks is our handle on Facebook, TikTok, Instagram, Twitter. And Soraia.com is our website, S O R A I A. And then, you can find us on Bandcamp. It's WCR Bandcamp, Wicked Cool Records Bandcamp, you'll find our Bandcamp, has all our songs on it. However they are sold out of all of our albums, so our physical albums, you'll have to go to our Soraia.com and our merch store. 

[01:02:35] Some record stores carry them, but I don't know which ones a lot in this area and Philadelphia area and, outside Bucks County area, Jersey. But as far as other record stores, I'm not sure. You have to check with them. You can order it. They can order it though. or just get it through our website too, but we're running low on some of the singles. You can only get through us. They're all sold out everywhere else. 

[01:02:56] Charles: Okay. Yeah. Cause I, I ordered Bloom off your website and I, I think I got it in less than a week, so that was pretty quick turnaround. So yeah, that was good. 

[01:03:05] ZouZou: That's good. If we're home, we're pretty quick when we're on the road, we forget. And then people are like, did you send that? I'm like, oh, my God. So, uh, yeah, but yeah. That's where you can get our merch. We are re-releasing Shed the Skin on vinyl later this year I think. Um, a 15 year reissue and we remastered it and we put it on two different color vinyls.

[01:03:26] That'll be coming out through Wicked Cool and us. We'll both have different color vinyl. Limited run and, uh, that'll be later. Hopefully, I think it's going to be later this year. It depends. We're just approving the masters now. So we have to see how long it is to the vinyl is going to take to turn around.

[01:03:42] But if not this year, then early next year, but that's our next release and obviously, the vault series has some tiers left, and you will get the back vaults as well. That's through our website. And then we just have a bunch of shows, which also you can see our website, West Coast, Midwest, South. 

[01:03:58] Charles: Yeah, it's all laid out on the website and the website's great. All right, well, with that, this has been a pleasure and, really interesting conversation ZouZou and, Doug and I will, we'll see you at the Liar's Club in September.

[01:04:13] ZouZou: I really enjoyed the questions were really fun. I know I talked a lot, which means I enjoyed the conversation. Thank you. 

[01:04:19] Charles: Great. Thank you.